1.

Solve : GROUND BOUNCE - Locking up & Shuting down your computer??

Answer»

Have you ever heard of a phenomenon called GROUND BOUNCE?

Ever since I have moved into this residence, I have been experiencing computer Lock-Ups & complete power shut downs without any warnings what so ever. Now, I live in the Niagara area and as you may know, there are many power stations and mega towers and hydro lines the size of small tree trunks in very close proximity to where I live. Has anyone ever heard of or acknowledged this phenomenon to be true in any way, shape or FORM? To be honest with you all, I was even entertaining the thought of a Low-Level EMP when all of this started happening.

I have been asked repeatedly to install the Microsoft Windows Update ( KB981349 ) which led me to researching all of this in the first place. In every instance, I have allowed the update. Yet, at Boot-Up time without fail, there it is once again asking me to install ( KB981349 ). Frustrating to say the least. Can you help in this matter?

Some research I have been doing on my own here:

=============================================================
GROUND BOUNCE
In electronic engineering, ground bounce is a phenomenon associated with transistor switching where the gate voltage can appear to be less than the local ground potential, causing the unstable operation of a logic gate.


 Description

Ground bounce is usually seen on high density VLSI where insufficient precautions have been taken to supply a logic gate with a sufficiently low resistance connection (or sufficiently high capacitance) to ground. In this phenomenon, when the gate is turned on, enough current flows through the emitter-collector circuit that the silicon in the immediate vicinity of the emitter is pulled high, sometimes by several volts, thus raising the local ground, as perceived by the transistor, to a value significantly above true ground. Relative to this local ground, the BASE voltage can go negative, thus shutting off the transistor. As the excess local charge dissipates, the transistor turns back on, possibly causing a repeat of the phenomenon, sometimes up to a half-dozen bounces.

Ground bounce is one of the leading causes of "hung" or metastable gates in MODERN digital circuit design. This happens because the ground bounce puts the input of a flip flop effectively at voltage level that is neither a one or a zero at clock time, or causes untoward effects in the clock itself. A similar phenomenon may be seen on the collector side, called VCC sag, where VCC is pulled unnaturally low.

=============================================================
windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe - What is the cause of windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe error?

    * Damaged swap file
    * Corrupt file allocation
    * Broken password list
    * Invalid Windows Registry
    * Low disk space
    * Invalid windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe file
    * Missing windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe file?
    * Hardware malfunctioning, over clocking, ground bounce, and RF noise
    * Improper BIOS Settings
    * Incorrectly installed third party software

Installing and uninstalling and modifying system components can leave your registry with invalid or harmful files. Most of the time, dll errors are caused by a corrupted registry.

=============================================================
I know it sounds like an advertising gimmick to sell some sort of FIX-IT TOOL. That's why I'm asking the pros here for some assistance. Taking into consideration that I do, in fact, have all the ingredients for this phenomenon. Any input would be much appreciated.

God Bless

Doc
sigh.Interesting research but unfortunately, but I can't help youThanks Allan for feeling my pain - LOL.

Thank you Ryder17z for the interest to read it and respond.

I'm thinking that this may very well become a very hot topic.

Doc

Quote from: Doc_Vibe on December 25, 2010, 09:11:49 AM

I'm thinking that this may very well become a very hot topic.

I truly hope not  Quote
I know it sounds like an advertising gimmick to sell some sort of FIX-IT TOOL.
It probably is. Especially since it doesn't even really make sense.Lightning rodsIf the OP is really serious, I will respond will logic and reason.
Otherwise - my usual sonnets.  Ground Bounce has absolutely nothing to do with any of your "issues".  What makes you think you have the ingredients for this phenomenon?

If it were as serious as you think it may be, the computer wouldn't work at all.  The designers would have recognized issues long before production & dealt with it accordingly.

Power companies go to great lengths to insure power quality.  If you really do have a power line noise issue, call you local power company (Niagara Mohawk?).  You might convince them to run a power line analysis.Everything commando said is true.

But I just have to make some remark, can't resist.
Most modem PCs will not hiccup even if there is a power loss for 500 ms more or less. And not power down even with a 50% voltage surge under 200ms.
And never has a any power line anything or earthquake, or bomb explosion, or cosmic rays  cause an OS to become very unstable.  Maybe shut down, but not un stable. It would be easier to toss a coin and have it land on edge. Quote
windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe - What is the cause of windowsxp-kb981349-x86-chs.exe error?

If Windows Updates are failing to install you can get help at the Microsoft Update Solution Center - http://support.microsoft.com/ph/6527#tab0

You could also try dwnloading the update from here - http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/en/details.aspx?familyid=CB21D276-65E9-4C8F-96E3-CF6DC36D0133&displaylang=enDoc, with all of the different problems that you've been describing I think that your BEST course of action would be to do a wipe and clean install. If that doesn't solve the problem, then we could move onto hardware troubleshooting.

Just my opinion. ok - update here. I had another complete power failure this morning (ironically, just after posting this new thread) and when I went to reboot with the main power button on the front of the puter as per norm, both the Power LED & the HD LED lights came on and then went right back off immediately. The puter was completely dead after that. So, I went looking elsewhere for the problem. knowing full well at this point I was looking for a power problem I started with the power supply. I took it out of the puter and cleaned it. I mean it took me a good hour to clean this thing. It had been sitting in there for some seven years and it showed it in every way. After cleaning it I got out the handy dandy Multi-meter and proceeded to perform a bench test. I was getting v0.15 on the yellow and nothing at all on the red wire from the power leads to the drives. Then I tested the main board plug wires and got v0.24 (max) on the yellow and v0.75 (max) on the orange wire. Nothing on any of the other wires at all.  Oddly enough, yes, I could hear the echoes of Scotty bellowing out "I need more power captain!" So, I'm like, ok, it's Christmas day and I need another power supply. Everybody is gone who lives here except for my oldest brother (The Sloth) who is not much use for anything even when he is awake. Except for consuming mass quantities of unhealthy groceries and defecating. so, I decided to go on a hunt in the back yard here which, in the minds of some, could be deemed a junk yard. Took me about ten minutes to find one. It was laying the bottom of an old 200 gallon home-oil tank that someone had cut a hole in the side of and was full of old discarded computer parts. There it was all covered in snow and under the snow a decent layer of dirt and to top it all off, yes, it was frozen to the bottom of the tank. I mean, this thing had been outside for Lord knows how long in this tank in the rain and all the elements, susceptible to all KINDS of animals bugs, you get the picture I'm sure and yes there really was a live spider still living in there. I brought it in and cleaned it. It took like, two hours because I had to blow dry it as I was cleaning it. Got it all back together and bench tested it. In short I was getting much better readings from it as opposed to my old one I had taken out of the puter. I plugged it in and low and behold I am now typing this message to you now. I'm getting v5.17 off the red and v12.24 off of the yellow wire from the drive leads. I'm not going to test the main board plug, mainly because I'm not going to go through all that hassle for nothing because I know it works.  Please, I don't want to sound arrogant in anyway here but, this is how I got the name "Doc" in the first place because I really can fix or build most anything. Doesn't matter what it is. Not to mention, I can be very resourceful when I need to. Ya have to admit thought, that Ground Bounce phenomenon is a very interesting concept though eh!

In the pic you can see the old power supply sitting on top of the puter and the replacement sitting half in and half out of the puter sideways. Just wanted to make sure everything was going to be ok before buttoning it all back up and installing it properly, which it is now. Anyhow, much thanks to all who posted here for your input and help.

Thanks for the links JJ 3000 I will look into that as soon as I get out of here. As it is right now the puter seems to be running fine, so I think I'll hold off on the HD Format for now. See how things go.

Again with the puter back up and running fine, I'll hold off on the call to Ontario Hydro for now as well there Computer_Commando, but I do appreciate the input.

Quote
If the OP is really serious, I will respond will logic and reason.
Not sure what OP MEANS Geek-9pm but have another beer - cheers and thanks.

Anyway, I guess we can call this thread - case closed. Once again, Thanks to all for the input. Have a Merry merry & a Happy happy. See ya'll soon.

God Bless

Doc


[recovering disk space - old attachment deleted by admin]As a smoker myself, I like the foil dish ashtray filled with butts!


Discussion

No Comment Found

Related InterviewSolutions